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542 days ago.
by neocurmudgeon74
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#1

Dare I start this thread?

Left-wingers/Right-wingers/Middle-of-the-roaders, Does the masses truly have the ability to govern themselves? Is true liberty and democracy ceded to the people by sheer majority rule? Need there be a strong central leader/government to guarantee personal freedom? Can a republic depend upon the common people for its survival? Or will apathy and ignorance of the people allow a dictatorship to evolve as long as individual/groups wants are being catered to?

 
 

Member Comments

neocurmudgeon74

I like to be hopeful. If a few of us will not only adhere to these standards in our own postings, but find a way to gently point out to others when they stray (hopefully in a way they won't see as combative, which I admit is difficult to do w/ some people), maybe a few others will follow good examples.

Posted 542 days ago.

mythravere

Thats all good and well but some people can not tell the difference between attacking someones arguments and their person.

I rank that right up there with people who disagree with something about someone and immediately assign a label of "evil" to them.

Posted 543 days ago.

harryanderson

Tiredofit writes, “They have made this PERSONAL and we take sides like (it’s) a competition, us vs. them. The media is (complicit) and gives us a healthy dose of meaningless drivel…to keep us occupied.”

This is true, except I’d like to more strongly emphasize that we, rather than they, are to blame. We eagerly open our mouths wide for the “healthy dose of meaningless drivel” that the media drug dealers give us. Not only that, we pay the drug dealers well for our fix.

As an individualist and Republican, I refuse to consume, or feed others, the “meaningless drivel” of personal animosity. Who’ll join me in refusing to attack peoples’ persons and only attack their arguments?

“As iron sharpens iron, so a man sharpens the countenance of his friend.” We have to consider one another friends in order to edify, on receive edification from, one another.

Posted 543 days ago.

Tiredofit

Interesting article Myth

Posted 547 days ago.

mythravere

LOL! I guess we do agree on things. I wrote my last post without seeing your last two until I posted mine.

Thats why I ask myself whats the real reality of it all.

Its hard enough for me to get a bead on things and I like to think that I can cut through the BS. For the average folk who aren't engaged? Might as well put blinders on them.

Google this and read it.

Anti-Gun People Who Cluelessly Mocked Me Still Live in Fantasy Land, Still Don’t Know How To Apologize

This is what we have to deal with. A very high level of head in the a55ness.

Posted 547 days ago.

Tiredofit

Our Govt is not nor has it ever been a finely tuned machine by design. I do get your analogy however. Its suppose to be hard to pass laws, raise tax and spend money. I still think it comes down to the fact that this is PERSONAL. We are being used as willing pawns in this game, left and right.

Posted 547 days ago.

Tiredofit

Would love to stay and debate but Honey boo boo is on TV. Night.

Posted 547 days ago.

mythravere

There is a solution to those problems but it will take real leadership and media that doesn't have an agenda.

People have to understand that we all aside from some differences have to be on the same page when it comes to the key ideas and concepts that made our country what it is today.

Its time for people to stop being Democrats and Republicans and to stand up and be Americans first and foremost.

But that cant happen when we have media and politicians dividing this nation.

In a sense our nation is like a car or truck. All the parts have to work together to make it down the road. Ours has been a reliable ride so far. Now too many parts are being changed around with and fiddled with hampering that reliability. We about got ourselves a jalopy now instead of fine tune machine we can count on.

Silly way of putting it but I hope the point comes through.

Posted 547 days ago.

Tiredofit

You dont have to look real hard to see what they are doing to us. They have made this PERSONAL and we take sides like its a competition, us vs them. The media is complicent and gives us a healthy dose of meaningless drivel like shiney objects to keep us occupied. Ohh look at Miley Cyrus' new haircut.

Posted 547 days ago.

Tiredofit

MYTH I think there is something we can do but it wont be easy. We have to stop buying into the daily lines of BS that those that wish to divide us are putting out. You dont have to be very bright to understand that you cannot have two stories that are 180 degrees apart and believe that one story is true and one a complete lie. They are BOTH lies, just different twists to the lies. We must demand the TRUTH from the media and our elected leaders and not excuse bad behaviour because " hes our guy".

Posted 547 days ago.

mythravere

Out on Route 2 coming back from Mason there was a sign. It said "United we stand. Divided we fall"

Couldn't be truer words these days.

That is sad and scary.

Posted 547 days ago.

mythravere

" I am not talking about a particular religious morality but rather the fiber of our being as a nation."

You hit the nail on the head right there. The thing is though is I seriously doubt there is a single thing that can be done about it.

There is a contract that each and every person has with this nation. Things that we HAVE to do to maintain what we have.

Things like being an informed voter. Being a good worker. You know doing our part and all.

That is what is falling apart. The reasons you mentioned are ones I can agree with as being a problem.

That being said I see no real solution to those problems.

Its why former nations and empires have fallen from their height. I mean my goodness look at Great Britain and so many others. They couldn't keep it together and fell apart.

I think that is were we are headed. How far we will fall is anyone's guess. If we aren't smart we risk losing everything.

Posted 547 days ago.

Tiredofit

I couldnt give a single rats behind if you are an atheist, gay, black, green or purple, man or woman. As a matter of fact, I dont care too much about any aspect of your life until it affects me and my life. I do of course care that you have enough to eat, are warm and safe but it is MY DUTY as a neighor and citizen to see that you are so, not the Federal Govt.

Posted 547 days ago.

Tiredofit

Myth you say things are changing but the truth is the morality and ethics of the country are going to pot. I am not talking about a particular religious morality but rather the fiber of our being as a nation. Things like the work ethic, the victimhood mentality, abortion, vulgarity in media and everyday life. The entitlment attitude and the race issue. Political correctness does not allow for discussion of these issues and our children are indoctrinated daily. I am a Conservative Myth and believe in God but I bet we agree on FAR more than we disagree.

Posted 547 days ago.

mythravere

Exactly! Its just crazy that people can't see and accept that our nation is changing. Certain viewpoints are slipping away. Like the notion that the way conservatives think is becoming less the norm and the fact that white people are on the track to become a minority at some point in the future.

Posted 547 days ago.

moderation

Those who feel our system of electing our legal representatives is problematic must not truly believe in this democratic republic. The process is what it is.Domestic opposition is to be challenged by the ballot,..... if you really want to walk your talk. If not, then,at this stage of the game you may be a thug and a criminal if you believe you have a "right" to physically act to eradicate any political opposition.The"they'll never take me alive" motto in today's society doesn't, in my opinion,demonstrate a helpful maturity for changing and improving this country.

Posted 547 days ago.

neocurmudgeon74

Bolo, I was about to point out that you confused "conservation" w/ "conservative". (They SHOULD overlap quite a bit, but in our politics these days they overlap very little.)

But then I realized you know they aren't the same, & consciously conflated the 2 terms. So I have to ask you, please keep the discussion to what you mean, don't use talking points you wouldn't accept from someone else. You're better than that.

Posted 547 days ago.

mythravere

We people allow themselves to see their neighbors as enemies how can a nation hold itself together?

You can blame liberals all you want but if your choice to see a fellow citizen as an enemy leads to actions that cause a civil war which will kill this nation as we know it.

Who's at fault for damaging the nation in that case?

This is were conservatives are doing the wrong thing. You care about this nation yet by way of the actions being put forth by conservatives you are breaking the social bonds that bind us all together.

That can destroy a nation as much as any military action.

I disagree with conservatives but I sure as heck dont see them as some occupying force bent on the destruction of this nation.

But if a friend goes nuts and tries to hurt you a man has to defend himself.

Posted 547 days ago.

mythravere

You just framed the problem pretty well.

Its gotten to the point that anything that doesn't fit into a very narrow band of rightwing ideology is leftist, Marxist,socialist whatever the daily flavor is.

If it aint hard right then it must be wrong right?

As for the rest of your post. Let me say I dont plan on letting myself get killed.

If someone is going to kill me then I have no issue with doing the same to them.

I do have guns but more importantly. If necessary I can act the part of a "patriot" and blend right in with that crowd.

But it really doesn't matter what happens to me if it does go that way. This country will be dead if that happens. It will wreck the economy. And we may have nasty surprise on our door step in the form of China taking advantage of the situation.

I dont know your willingness to "pull the trigger"on another revolution. But know this. You and yours do that....you are signing the death warrant for this nation.

Posted 547 days ago.

mythravere

All it would take is one act of violence dealt in the right manner to light this nation on fire. Its sickening to think about it and scary.

There are people I work with who I know for a fact that if the hammer fell and we started fighting each other (as in another civil war)they wouldn't look to kindly on me. In fact given my beliefs (atheist and non conservative)I shudder to think what would happen to me.

Posted 548 days ago.
 
 
 
 

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